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  #1  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:17 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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Default Aircraft repair/reconstruction units

From 12 O'Clock High!:

Fran
Bf109 Repair Depots
Sat Jan 3 17:51:06 2004
62.174.101.18

How many ‘frontreparaturbetrieb’ (Repair Depots) were entrusted repairing combat damaged or crashed Bf109?

I know ERLA stablished one very important with thousands of labourers in Antwerpen.
There was any other facility for the Bf109?


Thanks
Fran
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  #2  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:18 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Ed West
Repair depots
Sat Jan 3 19:33:18 2004
64.7.186.21

The following site is in Finnish and English. Scroll down for English (2nd paragraph).

http://www.jiop.fi/ksimuseo/faq_mtvalm.html



regards,
Ed
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  #3  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:19 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Fran
Repair depots
Sun Jan 4 14:40:31 2004
62.174.102.157

Thanks Ed for your input.
About the airframes with two manufacturing plates I found
the folowing story:
http://www.yumodel.co.yu/batajnica_a...two_me109s.htm

Regards
Fran
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  #4  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:19 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Ed West
And thank you for the link (nm)
Sun Jan 4 19:42:43 2004
64.7.186.254
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  #5  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:20 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Charles Bavaroise
Industrieinstandsetzung and Bf 109 G-10
Sun Jan 4 17:05:38 2004
62.245.161.24

Fran,

a very intersting topic. Here my two cents:

1)


There is not much published information on Luftwaffe repair-industry (>>Industrieinstandsetzung<<) yet and it is very difficult to get a clear picture. As for the Bf 109 I found this data, which may serve as a frame for further research:

No information available for the situation up to summer 1941. Known repair-facilities for Bf 109s during this time were

- Amme-Luther-Seek GmbH
- Flugzeugwerke Max Gerner
- Ludwig Hansen & Co.
- Industriewerk Heiligenbeil GmbH
- Erla Maschinenwerke Leipzig (?)

On 15.8.1941 GQM ordered the introduction of >>Luftwaffenfertigungsringe<< (Luftwaffe-Production-Ring) for coordination of manufacture of Luftwaffe-equipment. With order dated 2.12.41 the >>Reparaturindustrie<< was to be integrated into the Fertigungsringe.

On 20.4.1942 the former Luftwaffenfertigungsringe were shifted to the responisiblity of the Reichsminsiter für Bewaffnung und Munition (Reichsminister Speer) and renamed >>Sonderausschüsse << (“Special-Departments”). As for aircraft there were >>Hauptausschüsse>> (“main-departments”) for airframes, engines, armarment and equipment. Each one of the Hauptausschüsse was further divided into several Sonderausschüsse.

>>Sonderausschuss F2<< (as a part of the Hauptausschuss Zellen) was responsible for all matters concerning munfacture and repair of Messerschmitt-aircraft and so also had to manage repair for Bf 109s. A chart filed at F-2 from 1941 list the following repiar-centers for Bf 109:

- Jo-Flug Berlin
- Amme-Luther-Seek GmbH
- Erla Antwerpen
- Flugzeugwerke Max Gerner
- Ludwig Hansen & Co.
- Industriewerk Heiligenbeil GmbH
- Land und See
- Flugzeugwerke Mannheim
- Firma Marrien
- Flugzeugwerke Rudow

and also this centers outside of Germany:
- Flugzeugwerke Kjeller, Norway
- Flugzeugwerke Siebel, Athen
- ASAM-Pipera, Bukarest
- Land und See, Nikolejew
- Firma Espenlaub, Reval
- Firma Basser, Charkow.

A question I can't answer yet is, wether all this falilities were regarded as "Frontreparaturwerke". The German terminus "Front" indicates a connection to a fighting area. This would be true for all plants outside Germany, but not for facilities in Germany proper (if you don't see Germany as "Heimatkriegsgebiet" or home-front).


The situation in 1943 – 45 remains obscure. Ludwig Hansen certainly continued repairwork. One can assume, that due to allied bombing there was some sort of dispersal and new locations were opened. There is some evidence that there was a repair-facility at Chemnitz (“Chemona-Werke”) working under supervision from Erla-Leipzig and also at Regensburg-Prüfening. Prüfening was the former main-production-site for Messerschmitt Regensburg but was completely destroyed in early 1944. It is not clear, wether there was a real industrial repair-work in the ruins of the former plant or only a small workshop for maintainance of aircraft from the Regensburg-Obertraubling production center.

Next to this repair-industry there was a large amount of other facilities doing repair, rebuilding, upgrading and scraping (Werfteinrichtungen, Umrüsthorste, Schleusen,Luftzeugämter…..). There is even less information on this establishments and a lot of room for research.


Any comments, additions and correction are wellcome!


2)

The site of the Finnish Air Force Museum concerning the Bf 109 is generaly of a very high quality and very well researched. But IMHO the article concerning the production of Bf 109 G-10s is questionable (and also the article on WNr. 610.824 and 610.937 on yumodel.co). There is no evidence, that G-10s were anything else but newly built airframes and no repaired components were used for this subseries (accordingf to new information perhaps single G-14 airframes were upgraded to G-10 standard at ERLA Leipzig in March 1945, but this were not repaired G-14s, but aircraft taken directly from the belt). The saga of the “recycled” G-10s was established 20 years ago, when photos of G-10s seemingly with two Werknummer-plates first were published. We now know, that only one of the plates was a real Werknummer-plate, the other one was divided into six evenly spaced rectangles and had information stamped into, concerning the “Änderungsstufe” (“Level of Modification”).

Here also any comments, additions and correction are wellcome!


Carl
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  #6  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:21 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Dénes Bernád
Bf 109 repair centre at ASAM Pipera-Bucharest
Sun Jan 4 22:21:52 2004
149.99.126.105

I can confirm that the A.S.A.M. Works at Pipera-Bucharest did perform repair work from 1941 until the Rumanians' defection from the Axis camp on Aug. 23, 1944, and beyond.

Besides Rumanian '109s, German and Bulgarian '109s were repaired there as well.

Dénes
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  #7  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:31 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Andreas Brekken
andrebre@online.no
Frontreparaturbetrieb & Elbag Lager 918, Auxerre
Mon Jan 5 15:22:13 2004
80.212.196.128

Hi, Charles

We have retrieved data from the repair facilities at Kjeller in Norway, including listings of the aircraft which were repaired there. (Bf 109, Ju 52, Fw 190 etc)

I also find this topic interesting and would like to continue corresponding about it also outside this forum.

Regards,
Andreas Brekken
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  #8  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:32 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Fran
Re: Frontreparaturbetrieb & Elbag Lager 918, Auxerre
Tue Jan 6 16:57:16 2004
62.174.94.171

Andreas,
The aircraft repaired in Norway were from units operating
in that area or came from elsewere?

Regards
Fran
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  #9  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:32 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Andreas Brekken
Repairs at Kjeller
Tue Jan 6 17:09:03 2004
80.212.200.233

Hi.

The repair facility at Kjeller seems to have been serving the units in Norway.

As far as we can tell, it seems that most of the aircraft damaged in the area commanded by Fliegerführer Nord(Ost), had repair facilities in Finland at their disposal for most of the war.

Regards,
Andreas
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  #10  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:33 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Franek Grabowski
Are you interested in the Me 109 only or the whole industry? (nm
Mon Jan 5 17:26:19 2004
80.54.88.184
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  #11  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:36 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Fran
Re: Industrieinstandsetzung and Bf 109 G-10
Tue Jan 6 10:33:25 2004
62.174.101.129

Thank you Charles, great contribution to the forum. Definitely there are a lot to reseach in this matter but there are very few literature available.
About ERLA repair shop in Antwerpen (Belgium) there are a 8 pages interesting chapter with many photographs in the book published at 1977 by Ian Allan Ltd. London:
‘Messerchmitt Bf109 at War’ by Armand van Ishoven (ISNB 0 7110 0770 5)
I think that Reparaturbetrieb ERLA VII at Antwerpen was the most important producing a totally repared and overhauled Bf109 every hour. From July 1940 to February 1944 betriebführer (production manager) Fritz Bartsch
reported the 3000th machine.
Also produced locally the Rüstsatz to convert the cockpit ventilation of older types to Bf109G-5 standard.

Regards
Fran
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  #12  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:38 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Luc Wittemans
Erla Antwerp
Tue Jan 13 13:17:44 2004
193.191.210.2

There is a very good book (in Dutch unfortunately) about the Erla Werke at Antwerp. It is part of a three wolume book about Antwerp airport in WW2: 1. Belgian use in 1939-1940 and Luftwaffe 1940-1941 (KG 3); 2. Erla; 3. RAF in 1944-1945.

Author is Jean Dillen and publisher is "De Krijger" in Belgium.

Luc Wittemans
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  #13  
Old 01-26-2004, 11:38 AM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From TOCH!:

Dénes Bernád
Other small Bf 109 repair Depôts
Tue Jan 6 13:51:46 2004
149.99.112.250

For example: Caproni (Italy), Siebel, Athens (Greece).

In August 1944, the above 2 depôts repaired 12 and 5 Bf 109s, respectively. A.S.A.M. at Pipera repaired 6 Bf 109s.

In total, 473 Bf 109s were repaired in August 1944 throughout Europe. Out of this number, 358 aircraft were assigned to combat units, 60 to schools and 55 to other factories for Umbau.

Is somebody noting these info, so perhaps a small article can be compiled later on?

Dénes
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  #14  
Old 02-01-2004, 03:04 PM
Richard T Eger Richard T Eger is offline
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From within a thread on 12 O'Clock High!:

Wolfgang Meighoerner
Re: KG 55
Mon Jan 12 13:21:21 2004
62.104.220.89

Hallo Steve,

it is my father. I just checked out his airplane number (G1+HH) which was wrong in terms of the regulations, but is was a plane from a reconstruction unit and they just painted the wing's number on it.
I also found recently the navigator of my father, who told me details of the crash, which was caused by Red Army AA fire. Because my father over decades refused to tell about his wartime history I donated the Dierich book for his 70ith birthday.
Now I built a 1:48 model of "his" He 111 and what I am missing is some achival footage of the mission. As far as I recovered it was a bomb raid towards Smolensk. They received hits by AA fire over HKL and they tried to reach Lemberg, but they failed due to the burning engines. The crew was orderd to leave the plane by parachute in 800 m and my father tried to stabilze the plane, but jumped out of the right navigators window and was severely wound while hitting the "Leitwerk" (sorry, my English is not sufficient!). After that he fell into the hands aof russiian partisans but luckily kept alive and was brought to a Luftwaffe hospital where he stayed until Nov 1944. After that he returned to the wing and changed to Me 109 and Me 262 as "Blitzbomber" but never had a mission, because there was no more fuel for the planes.

So: if you have some ideas where one can find some material - please let me know.

Regards
Wolfgang

(The entire thread can be found on the topic "Books on KG 55 - 3" on the "References & Reference Materials" forum.

Regards,
Richard)
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  #15  
Old 12-19-2007, 02:12 PM
mikeshilton mikeshilton is offline
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Default Aircraft Repair/reconstruction units

I have just come across this post, when I was in the British Army I was stationed at Detmold, I was told that the airfield was where Bf109G's were bought in from various units and rebuilt or repaired. I have copy photos of various damaged airframes taken after a USAAF bombing raid, there is a photo of Detmold in the Charles Whiting book "BATTLE OF THE RUHR POCKET".
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  #16  
Old 01-26-2009, 06:59 PM
Mateusz Kowalski Mateusz Kowalski is offline
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Default Ludwig Hansen & Co.

Hello,

where can I find listings of the aircraft which were repaired or produced at Ludwig Hansen & Co. facilities? If someone has any idea please let me know.

Thanks!
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